3/29/06

Walking up and down the street ......Afraid of every man I meet......... Had enough and gettin' tough...... Puttin' on my black belt now..


A prelude to this post:

I debated not enabling comments on this post, I actually disabled comments for a little bit. I know this post classifies as a bonafide RANT, but in all fairness its my feelings Ive poured out in this post, and I couldnt bring myself to be subjected to trolls and acidic criticism.
I know that Ive been particularly hateful in this post. But whatever hateful things Ive mentioned was aimed at the Indian goverment, the moral brigade and chamchas of the Indian government ONLY and not all of mankind or men.

Remember patriarchy affects men as badly as it affects women. Patriarchy subjugates men to fit an unrealistic mould, to be 'macho', to confirm to unrealistic ideals like 'showing your feelings makes you girly' and worst of all...patriarchy forces men into sexism, even if they dont want to be that way. Patriarchy coerces men into unconciously indulging in misogynistic behavior.

So I hope you get my drift.
Im sorry if I have hurt anyone's sentiments.


Curiosity I think, is what made me enable comments again.

Just when I thought I'll fill my blog with light, frivolous and cutesy, what-did-I-eat-for-brunch-and-other-enlightening-titbits-of-my-life kinda posts, something comes along and schlep's me back into reality. Now I know that I've recieved a not-so-sizeable-but-conspicuous-enough amount of flak from some of you, about my so called 'female centric' posts.

To those of you who can see reason, let me explain.

I may sound very contentious when it comes to talking about women's rights, but that IS a part of my essentia and I cannot cast off that part of me. If you still havent noticed that by now, you need to invest in
this.

So, here we go.

I was immersed in my usual rounds of random news-website surfing, when I came across
this enlightening bit of news.

Here is an excerpt:

A hostel in Madurai has been forcing students to maintain a public register of their menstrual cycle.

This is to prevent premarital sex and to ensure that teenage girls do not go astray.

The invasion of privacy has been taking place for years at the government hostel for poor and backward class students in Tamil Nadu's Madurai district.

The register has columns for the exact dates of their cycle. Even slightly irregular dates invite snide remarks and harsh reprimands by the hostel warden.

Another excerpt from the same article:


The hostel has just one bathroom but that is exclusively for the warden. The girls can enter it but only to clean it and not use it.

Ironically the moral brigade is unconcerned about the fact that the girls have to bathe out in the open after dusk.

I guess I convinced myself that I'll never see this day. I know I've used an extremely acerbic tone in my previous posts....but deep down, I've always harbored a silent wisp of hope and fealty in our system, somehow wishing that things will get better.

How naive of me.

I should have known that patriarchy has women cornered at every turn. I can see images of rape, of foeticide, of impotent scum controlling women in the name of 'morality', of women being blamed for and used as pawns in the biggest aberrations of history, I can see it all.
I want to run to these women, to hold them, to help them, but what can be done?
What can you do, if cunningly and methodically, patriarchy has seeped into our very being? What can you do if patriarchy has made it a point albeit a mission to HATE women and everything connected to womankind? Why so much hate? Why, why, why?

The 'moral brigade' of our country feeds on this hate. Street harassment, dowry deaths, seclusion during periods, infanticide, child-marriage....and this hate-list goes on and on. What binds all the aforementioned atrocities? The fact that WOMEN are blamed. in one way or the other for EVERYTHING. Examples:

Street harassment: Oh, she was asking for it, by dressing like that.

Dowry deaths: The cow-bride did not provide enough money. So it was her fault.

Seclusion: Women are dirty. Our Dharmic Shastras say this(what shasthras, you'll never get to know...just a vague reference to Dharmic Shastras is what youll get on questioning).

Infanticide: Girls are a 'burden'.

Child marriage: Now this....I cannot fathom the reason behind this monstrosity. I really cant.

So, how can you live and thrive in a society which hates you only because you were born a woman?

As I sit here and write this, my soul cleaves in half at the hatred perpetuated by patriarchy, the deep-seated abhorrence I feel in my bones because of feeling the way I do, of wishing that I didnt feel this way, of hoping/praying that something somewhere will change.

And here is another issue which has irked my very being.

The murder of Meher Bhargava.

Not too long ago, didnt we all post about Street-sexual-harassment?
I particularly mentioned, that we have to fight back, did'nt I?

Fie on my decision to mislead the women of India. We should never fight back. Never, ever, fight back. Because you never know, an impotent swine with a political backing might just shoot you in the neck. Uh-huh. Please put up with groping, lascivious looks, old horny sex-starved pigs pleasuring themselves in front of you, and so on. Atleast you'll remain alive.

Being the cursed animals that we are, we tempt the men with our carnal looks and desires, so we deserve to be shot and killed if we fight back. Let us please emulate heroes like
Sachin Pahadi, for cleaning the Indian society of its filth: its women.

How do you deal with incidents like this? How can you live with yourself knowing that the hate within you and the hate perpetuated by the society has entwined itself?

I am not going to find answers........and I dont wish to find them either.

The moral police of India, and vermin like Sachin Pahadi, only stand to pique my repugnance with their filth.

Post Script: Many thanks to Desipundit for bringing light to the Meher Bhargava issue, by making it a sticky post and featuring this rant of mine.

138 comments:

Negative Creep said...

"I mean, I'm just tired of being wrong all the time just because I'm a guy.
I mean, how many times can everybody tell you that you're the oppressive, prejudiced enemy before you give up and become the enemy. I mean, a male chauvinist pig isn't born, he's made, and more and more of them are being made by women.
After long enough, you just roll over and accept the fact that you're a sexist, bigoted, insensitive, crude, cretinist cretin. Women are right. You're wrong. You get used to the idea. You live down to expectations.
Even if the shoe doesn't fit, you'll shrink into it.
I mean, in a world without God, aren't mothers the new god? The last sacred unassailable position. Isn't motherhood the last perfect magical miracle? But a miracle that's impossible for men.
And maybe men say they're glad not to give birth, all the pain and blood, but really that's just so much sour grapes. For sure, men can't do anything near as incredible. Upper body strength, abstract thought, phalluses—any advantages men appear to have are pretty token.
You can't even hammer a nail with a phallus.
Women are already born so far ahead ability-wise. The day men can give birth, that's when we can start talking about equal rights." - Chuck Palahniul, Choke.

Negative Creep said...

that's Chuck Palahniuk. and i'm sure you get my point.

Negative Creep said...

Maybe i should clear this up.

One, hate isn't just one-sided. Neither I, nor any of my friends have ever talked about women in the spiteful, hateful way that a lot of my felame friends talk about men. Generalizing is a crime.

Two, your posts are so unidimensional that you risk being written off as nothing but another male-bashing neo-feminist.

Three, what is your point exactly?

Four, we ARE the Indian government. I thought that was the whole point of democracy. And much as i love to bash the system too, what are you doing about it? Sure, you're in the US, but honestly, if you were over here, would you actually do something about it? women make up almost 50% of our population. That's an extremely powerful demographic. why doesn't that change anything?

Basically, hate doesn't change anything. The minute we degenrate into hating each other, we, you or me, are not better than the chauvinistic patriarchs. We're all on the same level.

Negative Creep said...

*female. Damn, i should go to sleep, i can't even type properly.

ambi said...

Tears from my eyes

Finally someone from the opp. sex who appreciates lungi...
http://tamilpunkster.blogspot.com/2006/03/lungi-longings.html

Kaushik Ramajayam said...

I used to firmly believe that the solution to all of this is education and awareness. But somehow, the more I read about stuff like this, more I'm beginning to believe that human beings are bad and that rule of might is the only way to curb such evils. I'm beginning to lose my faith in the fundamental goodness of people and their will to make things better.

A word about your comments on menfolk. Agreed that patriarchy is the cause of everything that you described. But that shouldn't translate into hatred against men. Hate the system, even hate the wrongdoers if you must. But don't hate all of us. There are still good people out there, even(?) men.

Jim said...

It seems like the only exposure (media/blog/otherwise) that we undeserving males get to critical opinions are those that are taken to extremes. Reading your posts, I sometimes imagine you as being driven so hard by rage that you lose a sense of objectivity. Sometimes. Then again, maybe you've achieved one little victory by pushing more of us (ie, males) into safe havens, where the only window outside is a 17" square of glowing phosphors. It's almost a shame that the only people this has any effect on are the very ones who'd never consider women as a sink for their frustrations in the first place. Anyway, keep writing, and Never Mind the Bollocks.

Deepali said...

menstrual cycle registers?

Like the chastity vow in an African country would get you monetary rewards promised by the President while he happily went on to marry his 11th-12th teenage bride.

tis a nice world we live in. O megha! you chalu girl! how dare you protest against all this and be ungrateful to all the good MANkind has bestowed on you [and me] ! They do it for your good, because you my dear need to be protected lest you go astray and be denied entry into heaven [because that might bring on a shortage of women as promised rewards to all the men who like all this, and if God fails on his word, all Hell will break loose no?]

Wrote about Meher Bhargav as well on www.vartalaap.blogspot.com [ iknow it seems like a dead blog but sometimes i do inject some life into it]

Yogi said...

really thoughtful article but this direction towards the indian side is kind of hard, after all , what does the bible do to the woman too, mary magdelene portrayed as a prostitute , what about the medival era of burning more than a million women to the stake? I would not even go to the extent of blaming the indian government, not before blaming the victorian era which ruled us for over a 100 years, being a feminist forever, i definitely think most of india's ideals were somewhere down the line overwritten by the always insecure about women victorians, they wrote off women from just about everything, but theirs seemed frivilous because it was only about banning a lady from entering a cricket ground. Its more a world problem which hasnt been addressed over centuries and if we dont do something about it, we would be part of the psuedo community who just keeps talking :), after all you did say you were hoping/praying, thats the "pussy" way(feminist in me had to say it, because i think its the worst term man came up with :))), but if you did do something about it rather than hoping someone would change it, well its just about what has led to it becoming this bad :)

Deepa said...

Hi,
A feminist here. Love your blog, but the page is not too reader-friendly :-(
Other than that, you go girl!

Madame Mahima said...

i think some of the commenters should realise that megha doesn't hate men..
its important to realise that most of us supposed male bashers dont hate men..we recognise the fact that much of the time in majority of rural india its women who perpetuate this patriarchal system..

and as for changing the system...sure we can..if the public is not so divided and not so hypocritical..each one of us is an idealist, we just lack the medium to go about making changes.

also important is education..we all recognise the need for it, but a country like indian thats got such a humungous population, how easy could it be to implement education reforms??
sure where theres a will theres way, but when half of the politicians and government officals are corrupted beyond recognition, how are we supposed to go about implementing changes?

negative creep..to answer ure question
"That's an extremely powerful demographic. why doesn't that change anything?"
i think the reason why nothing changes is because majority of these women have been taught since young that they have no voice, no rights, no nothing. they have been taught to depend on the male caregiver, they have been denied education, they have been denied their self-esteem.
with all of that, how are they supposed to change things?

i highly doubt brute force would work..

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ Mahi: Thank you mahi.....you have taken the words from my mouth.
if I raise my voice...theres a hundred men out there who are waiting to slap a "Megha hates men" TAg on my ass.....but the actual reality is that I dont hate men at all.
Thanks again chalu-sistah.
:D

nina said...

hey megha...where do u find stuff like this? both really made me sad...that things gone that much down the drain in this country...justice is an eye wash nowadays!!!

Vasu the terrible said...

I think you are right in some aspects about gender discrimination. India has a long way to go. Not in legal structures but people's attitudes. Afterall its a huge country of 1.12 billion people with almost a million cultures and subculutres. To bring all of them on par with one common morality code of whats acceptable is a logistical nightmare.

Considering the sheer spectre of India, such incidences do pop up on the radar very much. The media had uncovered the story of the madurai hostel girls and now the whole country is aware of this incident. This helps in building consensus on rights of people. It also educates many who would be in similar situations.

I think, if you are tackling issues in India, you need to have patience and a strong understanding of whats happening on the ground. Some points to be understood as background is.

1) The warden of the hostel is a woman.

2) Often caste clashes and conflicts end up targetting women. Why caste conflicts, any conflict ends up in targeting women. If there is a war, there would be rapes. If there is a civil war, women die first. Women issues form the litmus test towards highlighting the conflict.

If a man suffers in a caste conflict, it hardly surfaces and the women suffers it makes headlines. This issue is not about gender discrimination but caste conflict and a psychopathic warden gone mad. To taint this as the overall trend in India is not correct.

We all respect women's rights but a shrill cmapaign saying that women's rights somehow tower over human rights does greater disservice to the women's movement than anything else. There are millions of men and women who are caught under the caste yoke not knowing how to get out of that situation. there are millions of dalits still denied basic living conditions.

At the end of the day, the solution is the same. Education, Democracy, impartial implementation and People's laws.

But by making a shrill campaign with generalities like "men" etc. etc. a mockery is made of all decent humans who believe in commom public good.

Its asif there is only one way at looking at things. Pro-woman or anti-woman. Do we need to get into another rut to just free us from a previous one ?

I dont think so. I can rewrite the same analysis which doesent alienate everybody around and can advance the human rights issues forward.

The case of the hostel girls is not women's rights abuse. Its a human rights abuse.

my own 2 paisa.

vasu

Vasu the terrible said...

The madurai hostel episode FAQ.

Is that a crime of human rights abuse ? Yes it is.

Is it an example of patriarchy ? No. it is not. Its not asif the woman wanted to protect the girls from becoming free. They were targeted because they belong to a particular caste and thats the way they treat the caste.

Is this wrong ? Absolutely and the warden needs to be severely punished.

Why is it not a gender issue ? The issue of abuse translated itself into the sexual/mensural realm. if not for that it wouldnt have gained headlines.

What kind of laws do we need ? We dont need more laws, we need attitudinal shift in public and strong government implementation of existing laws.

When will that be achieved ? Not today , not tomorrow. For the sheer size and variety in values and morals. maybe will take a generation. You cant heat a large undaaa of water in a microwave oven.. can you ?

Whats the harm if we talk about it in gender specific terms ? By making it a gender issue, you are not including fair minded people who may not belong to your gender. Especially those high up in the government. You cannot by antagonisitc shouting on rooftops hope to change attitudes. You will only harden the resolve to reform. Secondly, this is a human rights issue and shrill feminism distracts it from what it really is.

well.. do feel free to add more qs.

vasu

nina said...

how did u like time traveller's wife...i thought it was grt!

Drops Of Jupiter said...

Megha- Fuck the apologetic disclaimers really...There is enough vile injustice against women-noone's apologising to them. Niether should you for writing your heart out on something you feel strongly about.

And hostels recording menstrual cycles? If I had a gun....fuckin' bastards...

WishfulThinker said...

That was a well written post and eye opening, to say the least. And what is up with that hostel in Madurai man? Like seriously!! BAH!

Negative Creep said...

@Vasu, perfectly put.

And my comments were not focussed on this post, or even this blog, but this attitude in general. Posts, and news articles, and books, and media events propogating such an attitude have led to a generation of girls who hate men, have no trust in the opposite sex, think that all men are sex-starved, prejudiced, bigots who have no other motive than to use them. This is not over-exaggaration, or me making this up. I'm talking from experience. I know girls who will never be able to fully trust a man, because it's been drilled into them by their mothers, and by the media that men are perverted, untrustworthy and dangerous. Imagine a 13 year old girl stumbles onto your blog, she will not understand whether or not you hate all men, or just the significant minority responsible for such crimes. All she will see is that men are unscrupulous, inferior creatures who deserve to be hated.

I haven't gone through all your posts, so forgive me if i'm wrong, but this blog is excessively negative. How many times have you highlighted organisations working towards the upliftment of women, or of men who have actually made a difference, a positive one?

Call me an asshole or an MCP, but i'm sick of being apologetic for being a man. I mean, fuck it. This is a society where the most outspoken feminists are really the closet sexists. It's gotten so bad, i'm afraid to look at a cute girl because i'll be accused of being a typical lecherous male. if i smile at a girl, that means i'm eve-teasing. I mean fuck that. And before you say anything, i know all about hosile stares and comments. Being a guy with shoulder length hair in a hick town full of homophobic assholes, i've had my fair share. But there's a difference between that and a friendly smile. I have friends who have been accused of having ulterior motives just because they went out of their way to be nice and helpful to a girl. Speaking out against misplaced feminist fanaticism is a crime. Any statement a man makes is put through the works, and twisted to make it sound sexist. The sexism card is so overplayed, that the intelligent, fair-minded people, just give up and let themselves be stereotyped because we're men and we're paying for for the crimes of a society we don't even consider ourselves a part of.

And women have as much a part to play in the promotion of sexism as men. For ages women have used men through the stereotype of weak women, who need to be protected. I mean we guys have been fucking played like a fiddle over the millenia. Now that we believe the streotype you set up, you're just as much to blame as we are. The media brainwashes us everyday into being sexist bigots. Educated, liberated women push the stereotypes of women as a weaker sex, and a flawed sense of virtuosity. Programs produced by women, written by women are today watched by millions of men and women across the country. Whaddya expect?

This was a rant. please ignore everything said because they're just the ramblings of a frustrated, sexist, bigot MALE.

@Megha, i never said that you hate women. I said that you RISK being written off as another male-bashing neofeminist. There's a difference.

blah_blah_blogger said...

The cops shot Pahadi but the lucky bastard escaped hurt

The Girl Who Sold The World said...

Now, I agree with Creep and Vasu to some extent. I mean, we can't generalize all the males in this world, or even, India, just on the basis of the patriarchy that prevails. Yeah, of course, women are subjugated, ill-treated, discriminated against but who's at fault? Just SOME men with rotten mentalities and no idea of equality in mind. But wait, only those men aren't at fault alone. I've always believed that the women who suffer all this abuse are also at fault. Dowry deaths? Why the hell can't the bride raise her voice against the abuse she suffers before being burnt alive?! Oh, I forgot that she believes that her husband is her "god" or some shit like that and that it'd be very very wrong to stand up against her bloody in-laws. All this in a country where there are more than enough laws to protect women! Street harassment? How many females actually answer back or report the asshole? Few. How many of the rape cases are reported? How many mothers stand up against female foeticide and infanticide? How many girls refuse to marry before they're mature? How many girls actually have their own mind, convictions, decisions and dare to stand up against injustice? Oh, and those Madurai girls, why couldn't they have protested against such a sick rule? Indian constitution has granted them so many rights and they can always stand up and fight against injustice. But no, they refuse to do that. Wonder why. Is living an oppressed life better than fighting for your rights?!
As far as feminists are concerned, I think most of them are anti-male creatures. I said, MOST, not all. They're not only against the entire male species but also against the females who actually try to act like "females"...you know, follow fashion, wear make up etc., that is, basically those who try to retain their feminity. Wonder what's so darn offensive about that.
Just like we cannot blame all the followers of a particular religion because of a few terrorists, we CANNOT blame the entire male species for what a few perverted sick fellows do.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ negative creep, vasu, the girl who sold the world:
I think I clearly mentioned that this post was a RANT, it was just my feelings poured out in a fit of anger.I think I made that clear.
And where did I say that all men are assholes.
I only talked about patriarchy and the moral brigade.
I also mentioned that patriarchy affects men as well.
Why do you assume that patriarchy = men?
I think theres a big difference.

I also mentioned clearly that this post was AIMED at the Indian goverment, the moral brigade and chamchas of the Indian government ONLY and not all of mankind or men....please.

I hope you get the point.
Cheers!
Megha

Negative Creep said...

^^ I addressed that point,

\\Four, we ARE the Indian government. I thought that was the whole point of democracy. And much as i love to bash the system too, what are you doing about it? Sure, you're in the US, but honestly, if you were over here, would you actually do something about it? women make up almost 50% of our population. That's an extremely powerful demographic. why doesn't that change anything?\\

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ ambi: hee hee, yeap...I spoke about the lungi.

@kaushik: again I spoke about patriarchy, not men. Theres a difference. I also said that patriarchy affects men as well.

@ jim: thanks.....and this was only a rant(Ive said this a million times).

@Dee: Ha ha...I think I gave it a little more life Dee....I commented there...check it out:D

@ yogi: Really yogi, how can I propose a solution when the women and men act as if it doesnt exist.

@ deepa: thanks!

@ nina: ndtv, man....and IT IS depressing.....ugh

@ drops of jupiter: thank you...*hugs*....but do you see the comments?...thats why I had to put in a disclaimer...and still people think I hate men and Im a male basher.

@ Wishful thinker: Thanks dude! God, I think I need a drink after this post!

@ blah_blah_blogger: Yeah! what is up with that? Really?

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ negative creep: Are we? Are Indian people actually the Indian govt? So there is absolutely no CORRUPTION, MORAL POLICING, NOTHING......rite?
People are 100% free to do what they please right?
Really.
How long is the Indian government going to hide behind a farce of a democracy?

50% of women? In India?
Pray tell me how when the sex ratio is 927 women to a thousand men and its still sinking.
and remember....as Mahima said, women are thought never to fight back all their lives. NEVER. EVER. It is hard enough to live with a hundred restrictions let alone face flak from the whole family for standing up for oneself.

Yogi said...

well ppl do know about it or we wouldnt be talking about doing something, its just a kind of awareness which should be created not through something as insignificant as a blog, even though it has a reach, and it is very easy to put a few words together from an alien land, seriously, i know i sound philosophical or maybe it is a state of helplessness itself which tries to pound itself into my head desperately trying to evolve a situation, for instance lok paritran is an organisation which is trying to make an impact, of being the first political party with a set of individuals aged less than 30..tahts a start!!

ashok said...

//The case of the hostel girls is not women's rights abuse. Its a human rights abuse// I agree with Vasu. I come from the glorified village of Madurai where this shameful incident happened and Iam sure there wud be lot of women there who wud have said "so what? whats wrong with that?" when they hear this incident. The greatest enemy of women are women themselves.

SamY said...

chillax lady ... everyone has some issue to rant about like this ... making noise is one side to it ... lay-back and think that "world is not all that bad place afterall" ... don't get too cocky bout any issues ... as u aptly put do something tangible about it

its typical of indians to prattle A LOT n do nothing

n do thank someone for giving a gud life for millions ... its better to appreciate the gud as much as think of the bad

cheers

The Happy Feminist said...

Wow- you're getting a lot of heat, Megha. This is the first post of yours I have read but I simply don't see any anti-male bias or extremity in what you are saying. I am quite surprised that people are giving you so much flak.

To the girl who sold the world: It sounds as though you are engaged in what's known as "blaming the victim." Yes, it can be frustrating when women don't leave their abusers or stand up for themselves, but as you yourself acknowledge, it's not necessarily such an easy thing to do. If you've been brought up all your life to believe your husband is a god, how on earth are you going to be able to leave him or tell him that he is wrong? Even if you don't beleive he is a god, how are you going to stand up to him if your community is against you or you don't have the financial resources to leave?

What I find puzzling about your comment, girl who sold the world, is that on the one hand you blame women who are victims and don't stand up for themselves, but on the other hand you don't seem to like feminist either, even though feminism is, in essence, all about pointing out and standing up to abuses. I understand that you have the impression that feminism is primarily about telling women not to be feminine, but critique of fashion and femininity is only one small aspect of feminism. I am one feminist who certainly wears make-up and heels and fashionable clothes. I don't have even the slightest problem with women who follow fashion. I do have a problem with telling abused women that their suffering is their own darned fault.

Keep up the good work, Megha!

Negative Creep said...

@Megha, of course there's corruption, moral policing and what not. All that means is that we as Indians are a bunch of corrupt, hypocritic, bigots. So, what's new??

And i said almost 50%.

@thehappyfeminist, All you're saying is that because women choose the easy road, they're blameless. hmmm, interesting point.

And what thegirl's talking about is that feminism today is too wrapped up in the insignificant issues and male bashing to actually focus on the important stuff.

And my posts were just a rant and should be taken as such. They were not specific to this particular post. And if you look at it objectively, you'll see that i have a point.

The Happy Feminist said...

Yeah, I am saying that a woman who is beaten or abused should not be blamed for having been beaten or abused or um burnt alive . Who says being beaten or abused or burnt alive is "the easy road?" I am sure for many of these women it is, or appears to be, the ONLY road. This business of blaming the victim sounds like an excuse to put one's head in the sand and say, "Not my problem." I don't know what the solution is to domestic abuse and violence against women in either India or in the U.S. -- but at least we should talk about how we can better serve this woman so that they CAN try to stand for themselves and we should place the blame squarely on the shoulders of the abusers.

And then here we have Megha talking about some pretty serious issues -- street harassment and extreme violence against women -- but somehow people on the thread want to characterize feminism as being primarily about trivial stuff like make-up. I get that a lot on my blog too -- I raise some unquestionably serious point that has nothing to do with fashion and people will inevitably say, "Why do feminists only talk about fashion?"

Deepali said...

checked, replied and found a new anthem [a rather undignified one at that but for now let's ignore it] !

Dawdler said...

it is regrettable and pinning all of it on society isnt gonna make it precipitate to anything... it may be heartening to look at it this way, these are issues drawing flak from all corners and ppl are tying to chg it and are not just hushed up like what it used to be in the not so recent past... a simple case of looking at a glass half-full or half-empty... a change is brewing , not expedetious enuf to merit a pat on the back..

Anna said...

I donno what to say.. and just when we thought it was over.. cant fight back... cant keep quiet...
Do you think there'll be a time when women come on the extinct list? That cant be what these chauvinist pigs are aiming for, can it? .. cos that addition will, of course, be followed by men unless science grows to throw up something new and weird..
Anyway, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO???

and in all fairness... child marriage affects males too...

Sriram said...

Sad.... reeeeal sad. I saw the news about the plight of those girls in the hostel... sick bastards is one term that comes to me. As for the moral brigade, all they do is shove their heads up their asses and sit with their thumbs up their ass and yak endlessly. Boy, I'd love to shoot them in the face, ala Dick Cheney.


P.S : Thou has been blogrolled. (no no, not because I like the template alone :P)

Negative Creep said...

Nobody's blaming the victim for being victimized. The perpetrator of the abuse is comepletely to blame. We're blaming her for letting it continue to happen and for not reacting, not doing anything about it. for letting them get away with it.

//but somehow people on the thread want to characterize feminism as being primarily about trivial stuff like make-up//

That was like one trivial point in the whole argument mentioned almost as a postscript in the last comment... Who's guilty of trivialising the issue now?? Maybe you should read the earlier comments to understand the point.

Agarwaen Mormegil said...

Horrendous, absolutely disgusting. *horrorhorror*. How much more insults will Indian women take? Even in 21st century? Thankee cloudygirl for such enlightning stories which will ceratinly have a short-term impact on me at least.
Don't mind those comments accusing you to be a radical femnist sistah with boring posts. No siree.
I mean recording menstrual cycles? what the fuck? BTW, that gives me the next topic for my "Straight Talk Express" column.
And building a society where women are subdued will only spring forth a weak society with weak males. It's basically self-destructing.
Damn, the post rocked me up.

Sriram said...

Noooooooooooooooooooooo *yelling in pain after being hit with "fluffy"*

and to ekshplain, MEgha @ meghalomania was already there, but honestly, I wanted to put in "Megha-Punk" for you, but that wouldn't be fun, would it? :P.. and hence the Megha II.. of course, the mouse-over (feminist and punk) is cuz you are indeed proud of both and is meant to be funny. (honest!)

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ sriram aka fluffy: It is funny! I have no qualms with Megha II, honest...muahahahahaha *evil laughter*

Agarwaen Mormegil said...

yay!! there's alrady a blog I go called "meghalomania". There's too many cloudygirls in the blogosphere. That too tam-brahms....:P. BUt our Megha is the real Megha. No fake or 2nd hand maal...:D

Sriram said...

Yes yes.. good that no offense was taken. But i warn thee.. I shall turn into my were-wolf self for sure if I see "fluffy" on the blogroll :P

Aishwarya said...

I hate that any expression of feminism is immediately interpreted as 'male-hating', and that when we talk about this (and how can we not talk about something that's so fundamentally a part of our identity? The way the world treats us?) we're told we're overreacting, we're monotonous, and we should stop harping on about it. We shouldn't need disclaimers to remind people that we don't hate men.

Also, I'm linking to your blog from mine because you have Angela Carter's Bloody Chamber in your favourite books. Hope you don't mind.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ yogi: yeah....so since its a blog and blogging is an 'insignificant medium' Im supposed to talk about happy frivolous things and act as if these issues dont exist?
really.

@ ashok: The geatest enemy of humankind is patriarchy. Patriarchy breeds hate. Women hate themselves, the view themselves as cursed, dirty/ insert other words here.
and since 'women are the greatest enemy of women', men are seraphic angels? Men are gentle souls incapable of perpetuating anything?
Please.
Patriarchy makes men and YES women to hate womankind, openly, discreetly....whatever.
But look at the messages on TV.....look at the things which are happening.....its not 'women being enemies of women'.

@ Samy: yeah I choose to rant about this. Bite me.

@ The happy feminist: thanks a freakin ton, for dropping by. yea did you notice the unecessary flak....even with the disclaimer et al?

@ Bhanuj: what are YOU doing about it? Youre in India arent you? Atleast I talk about it, even though I dont live in India right now.
Its very easy to point fingers Bhanuj like "what the heck are you doing about it....blah blah..."....but even something as insignificant as talking about an issue makes a difference...however cheesy it may sound.
We can never have 'TOO MUCH' awareness so to speak.

@ aragorn: hee hee...thankeeee! *Hugs*

@ aishwarya: Exactly. And EVEN WITH a disclaimer Ive been labelled a "shrill male bashing feminist".
How misogynistic.
Ive linked to you too.
Brown feminists are hard to come by.:D

the wannabe indian punkster said...

whoops, I my righteous anger I missed you guys...
@ Dee: hahahahahahaha yes we are 'chalu-girls' arent we?
God I cant get that word out of my mind now!

@ Dawdler: a change is brewing...slowly...but surely...

@ Anna: Really. I guess we are going to become extinct. I mean doesnt it break your heart to read stuff like this?

Negative Creep said...

I'm still 17, but i actually plan to DO something about it. I don't think i need to explain that here, but i actually plan to try and make a difference. And spreading awareness is all well and fine except for the fact that the vast majority of your readers have a level of education that means that they wouldn't indulge in such activities anyway(hopefully) and as for those who will. for the most part they're at anage where mindsets have already been set, and your spreading awareness is pretty much an exercise in futility.

I'm bored of this. Your post was a rant, and so were my comments. i saw your point, i hope you can try and see mine. Other than that, hey, it's your blog.

Negative Creep said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Negative Creep said...

//And EVEN WITH a disclaimer Ive been labelled a "shrill male bashing feminist".//

For fuck's sake, how many times do i have to clarify that i did not say you hate men.

And this reaction of yours basically means that anyone who dares to say something against your feminist posts is automatically branding you as a male basher. I mean it can go on and on. Considering how little it takes you to call our comments mysoginistic, i really don't think the misandry tag would be that far off.

But i'm not here to start a gender war. My point was pretty clear the first comment onwards, and it's sad that nobody seems to actually get it. Anyways, cheers.

Me.. said...

i totally agree with u that indian patriarchy system does get down the gutloads..!!

but not being able to do anything..!! well.. yakking about national issues and expressing just concern over them.. sitting in some foreign land.. well.., how brave can you be girl..!!

shout ur arse out from detroit.. and that is exactly what cowards who just wanna gather support and come out like neats do..!!

we are listening..!!

Negative Creep said...

^^ Err, what?? Dude, learn to make sense before posting anywhere.

Sriram said...

Wow! I am a were-wolf and than heavens I ain't named fluffy :P.. but an up-front were-wolf? I would have been soooooooooooo proud if I was named "sneaky-creepy-evil were-wolf", but hey, I ain't complainin :P


P.S : Sorry to act all funny on a serious post.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

heck sriram...you can most definitely be all funny on a serious post...and you can be extremely serious on a funny post....makes for well-needed comic relif you see:P

Madame Mahima said...

megha...all i have to say is good on you girl..and im glad you stand up for what u believe in.

negative creep you made some real good arguements...but i reckon the one arguement thats a complete 'non-arguement' is this one

"Nobody's blaming the victim for being victimized. The perpetrator of the abuse is comepletely to blame. We're blaming her for letting it continue to happen and for not reacting, not doing anything about it. for letting them get away with it."

i used to be pissed off at the victims too...like why the hell cant they stand up for themselves. why dont they have the guts..but in time you'll see its not always black and white..its very important to see issues such as these in shades of grey, then only do u grasp the full complexity and of it..
i dunno negative creep..i still think you missed megha's point..
but anyway!

this was a good debate!
lets agree to disagree
now..who wants margheritas? =D

ps- was 'me..' trying to diss or compliment u? i still dont get it :S

Madame Mahima said...

oh ok he was trying to diss you.

very clearly and coherently put!
well done.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ Mahi: I do I do!
how about an apple martini instead!
:D

Jim said...

"Sometimes." I even repeated it so it would stand out. My comment was not aimed at you (or this post) in particular, the observation was that feminists tend to have all the right effects on all the wrong people. Sorry for not being clear.

Yogi said...

it was not a dig at your blog that was never the idea, i was just saying thats not the right medium to try and address a problem, it does not have the required reach, after all everyone on here including the ones who are trying to diss you actually agree with you, all of us are ppl who already want and will do something about the current scenario, but to actually do something about it, this medium is quite ineffective and i think for you as a person who wants to do something about it, writing about it in a blog, i think, is not enough

Deepti said...

That is so disgusting!! Their money , time , resources..everything would be better spent in trying to maintain high education and hygeine standards!! This kind of moral policing sucks big time!! It reminds of certain schools and colleges in Chennai.. the administration thinks that strict rules and moral policing would make the kids behave.. they do.. but the second they are out of there.. its like ' avvutha outa kazhudhai'!! No one can rob you of your right to think , act and behave as moral / immoral as you wanna!! They can guide but never enforce~!!!! These kind of ppl need rude jolts to wake them up !!

KP said...

Hi Megha!
I want you to see this
http://one.aidindia.org/manipur/

Vasu the terrible said...

@all and esp. megha and the happy feminist. - See, My intention is just to question an extremist post by Megha. I dont want to be seen as giving a lot of heat.

i am just saying there are many ways to look at this issue. And which way you look at it does not matter unless you untie a knot, find a solution and build a better society.

Megha had posted a frustrated rant, and she has every right to do that. All of us get frustrated sometime or the other and we are allowed to let out a little steam. To that extent I agree with her.

Having said that, I genuinely feel that the shrill feminist way of looking at things causes more harm to the same issues the feminist's seek to advance.

In the argument megha had put forth (apart from it being a rant), there is no place for me. I am forced to either get frustrated in reaction or plain look at it as a feminist rant.

The reaction to her post's by myself, negative creep etc. etc. should be seen as the way this article came across. Men are creeps. Notwithstanding the disclaimer. The disclaimer was to protect the underside of the article and I think is not meant genuinely.

I agree with negative creep on some of the things he said. A friend of mine who has a particularly scary face and me were enjoying a nice smoke and a deep conversation. About unieverse etc. Like always this friend went on a thought loop and was wondering straight at infinity. Unfortunately for him a girl showing her cleavage walked into his radar and our man lost in thoughts continued staring ahead. I am sure in his eyes the girl and the her cleavage were out of focus... He was guilty of open-eyed-wondering. The girl took offence and without any further investigation came upto him and shouted all kinds of things. The public came togather in a threatening way. We had to make a hasty retreat.

As much as many men stereotype women, there are equal if not more women who end up in the feminist rut and end up incapabale of trust. I feel sorry for them because they lose balance quickly .

my only comment is. It is ok, to be fustrated, but you pay a personal price for that..

vasu

the Monk said...

Menstrual cycle registers: I think I more or less echo public sentiment when I say: FUCK.

Damn.I still can't get over it. The height of repression.

Seriously, forget the disclaimers. We needed to know about this. Brilliant job.

G U R U said...

hmmm...yet another fire from the not-a-wannabe-punk-anymore-but-a-fully-qualified-punk...great stuff miss ! keep it going...jus wondering about the title/subject of your next post :-D

G U R U said...

Btw, some GK material is waiting to get your immediate attention in http://jilponks.blogspot.com

Read through and get enriched !

:-D

Negative Creep said...

@Mahima, you're right, it's pretty much a grey issue. As hard as it is to actually do something, it's just as hard to watch them let it happen. They deserve it to themselves and to others to do something about it too... But then again, it's not that easy.. whatever, that wasn't even my argument anyway..

Vasu the terrible said...

Many times, truth gets shrouded in all kinds of imagery.

Sachin pahadi is not the killer. The Rawat guy pulled the trigger, as identified by Meher's driver.

Also The rawat guy acted as a supari killer (police's view) for someone else. So, ther is more to this story than just a honour protecting mother-in-law shot by evil creeps. Maybe we should wait for the whole story to come out and maybe we should rein in our horses.

I think media pronouncing someone guilty before even thorroughly investigating conspiracy behind the killing is the biggest problem here.

Moreover, what responsibility do they have ? They can claim to be concience keepers and forget the whole issue once the next newsworthy story comes about. Isnt it ?

"Sachin, Rawat.. whatever dude... who cares", right ?... All of them are the same, right ?

Meher's killing is a crime and we should not second guess what happened unless the whole thing is unravelled.

vasu

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ jim: apology accepted!

@ yogi: ahhhh yogi, but you dissed me yet again....but this time you diplomatically 'tried' to cover it up by saying //it was not a dig at your blog that was never the idea, i was just saying thats not the right medium to try and address a problem//
come on dude....really.

@ Deepti: VERY rude jolts....I wonder what will shake them up though....

@vasu: the disclaimer was not meant genuinely...blah...blah

Why would I try to cover up any part of this article?
you have read my previous posts havent you? Do I seem like a person who would cover up issues?
And you still think men=patriarchy.
How ridiculous is that?
I wrote this post based on the assumption that people have a basic knowledge of WHAT patriarchy is and how it functions.
You have proved me wrong.
Your comments are based on the sole assumption that I meant 'men are the cause of all problems'.
Somehow you got so riled up, that you started to attack me personally, YES personally....by questioning the intergrity of this post, and Im sorry that really does cross the line!
:D
Cheers!
Megha


@ prathiba: checked it out! shocked me beyond measure!

@ guru: quite a long hiatus eh? Will do.:D

Born a Libran said...

Just out of curiosity, do you know whether the warden who made the rule in the first place was male or female? I think it is pathetic to record menstrual cycles but this can only be recorded by women/snide comments can really by made by the same people... So why blame the men for this?

I certainly think it is disgusting and I think that the present social scene is what creates these kind of nonsense recordings. As you said, this is because of the illeffects of the patriarchial society we have, but at the same time, other places are also based on patriarchial society but the menstrual cycle recordings is something I have heard about for the first time. So why blame the men again?

Let me make my stance clear... Personally, I dont think you hate men and I also feel that there are somethings which men and women can not be equal (women can give birth to a kid, for example. Biologically, some things are just different) in but certainly, women should get equal standing in society with men.. I just dont see how you conclude that this is because of male superiority than anything else.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

did I say male superiority? I dont think so. I did attribute this to patriarchy...but I repeat myself albeit a million times that the assumption that patriarchy=men is ridiculous.

I clearly mentioned 'moral brigade'...which includes men as well as women.

Sriram said...

Ah! I am mosht happee when i yam allowed to be my clowny self at all times.. well, atleast most times. Glad I can bring some humor (and nasty PJ's too!)... assuming you know tamil, the following line is said in an ultra-serious tone. "Kanna, naan eppovume jolly-a joke adichittu iruppen. Aana, sudden-a serious aayiduven. Appidi aayitten-na, kalavaram thaan" :P (if you not knowing translation, I'd love to translate)

the wannabe indian punkster said...

oiii! onnaku ithu romba over illai??
"kalavaram thaan".
Adangu saar.....
:D
Megha

frissko said...

mostly agree with your opinions on this post..many wud...but the whole exercise is as inconsequential as a drawing room discussion...lotsof opinions will be expressed in righteous tones by ppl from varied corners and the women in madurai will continue to fill that register and Meher Bhargavas will continue to die...and soon, ppl'll be distracted by more current happenings that badly need opinions from ppl who can express them eloquently, and with flair...

Sriram said...

Heh heh.. echoos me.. *scene fades to black and cuts to sriram sitting on a "oonjal" in true thalaivar fashion* "nakkal adikkaradhu namma koodave porandhadhu... ennikkum pogaadhu" :P

Sriram said...

Damn!!! I never realised my comment on the previous post never got published due to glitches in the Matrix and so here we go...

Mega-man! Hmm... know what? Mega-man X was one of my all time favorite games... so let me call you Mega-{replace with anything from woman, dudette, bulb, tubelight etc} :D

Freaky Chakra said...

More "i-dont-agree-with-what-u-said" comments. Deja vu.

Since u urself had already declared that this was a rant, i dont really think there is any point in discussing reservations about the post.

As long as the rants dont become opinions, I think we all will be fine.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ freaky:
yeah.....but nobody really seems to understand do they?
I clearly mentioned this post was a bonafide rant, and I put in a huge disclaimer et al, and I still get attacked about 'falsely hiding behind a disclaimer, to cleverly expose her evil designs' and the usual 'ohh...male basher, shrill feminist...yada.yada.

Good to know that you got the point of this post.
:D

Anonymous said...

Wow. This post talks about injustices committed on women, and all the guys and some of the women seem to care about is the image of men.

Well, who is beating and killing the women? Why can't we talk about that? If you dont kill and beat women, you know we aren't talking about you. If these discussions make you uncomfortable, perhaps you should ask yourself why.

To several of the responders:
It is a woman's fault she is being beaten because she didn't leave? Where would she go? What if he follows her and kills her? It's fucking scary place to be, you know? Such a lack of compassion makes me so sad. I wonder why you focus so much on the one suffering the emotional and physical pain, rather than the one doling out all this emotional and physical pain. Is he not the one responsible? Is he not the one who should refrain from beating and abusing?

Women should report men who harass them on the streets? Right. What do you think a police officer would say, if they even bothered to show up?

Women should report rape? The conviction rate for rape in the US is incredibly low, and i would imagine it's even lower in India. There was recently a case here in which a gang rape of an unconcious woman WAS RECORDED ON VIDEOTAPE and the men got off! What more proof do you need? the woman was stalked and slandered for years by her attackers and their attorneys, as well. Right, just report it and it'll go away.

~sigh.

ASHA

Anonymous said...

Negative creep's first comment on this thread was "I mean, I'm just tired of being wrong all the time just because I'm a guy."

I'm tired of being harassed and raped and paid less and beaten and killed and denied proper medical care just because I'm a woman.

ASHA

Born a Libran said...

@megha : Okay, Okay, my bad... I can blame it on my hangover but I will not because it was a genuine mistake... The moral police might blame the women for day to day attrocities on women as u say but even they wont blame the women for what happ to Jessica Lal or what Sachin Pahadi did, right?

Vasu the terrible said...

@megha - Sorry if you got offended by the statement I made. I dint mean to question your integrity. Just replied to the post you had made.

See, the whole thing boiled down to patriarchy and gender debate rathar than the abuse issue.

Nobody, here says that its a woman's fault that she is a brunt of sexual and physical attacks. Nobody in their right mind would/should say that.

I think I was more keenly analysing the connections you make between patriarchy and abuses. Its too far fetched in my opinion because, there are numerous social, economic and caste equations conviniently ignored. I just thought there is many more dimensions to the madurai episode then what meets the eye. Knowing the madurai area very well, it irked me that wrong conclusions are drawn for whats happening. If we dont understand the core issues correctly, we will never be able to prevent human rights abuses.

Maybe I took your post far too seriously. maybe I should have taken it just as a rant.

I dont wish to argue on semantics and vocabulary. Its quiet well known that my vocabulary sucks. I should get myself a good oxford dictionairy.. :)

Thats all there is to say. Once again sorry if that statement offended you. It was not meant for that.

vasu

useless said...

Megha,
I did see the Madurai Hostel clip and was thinking about it.To me the issue seems quite complicated.
Yes, in principle I agree with all that you say but in India, a hostel warden's responsibility
is not as easy as signing a legal form 'we take no responsibility bla bla" as it is here in the US.
Moral policing, Imagine this scenario one teenage/minor girl gets pregnant.What happens to her in Indian society?
Does she have the luxury of saying,hell with the guy,so what I'll abort and go ahead with my life like you and me and scores of other women.I think not..Her life becomes hell and guardian/parents/establishment immediately needs to do something abt the situation.Get the warden..and her life becomes hell.So it is all about covering one's ass.

Again patriarchy as a concept and what has been practiced over the years is responsible.But why is it that I see more often than not many a female making moral judgements about those of their own gender? I just do not get the logic.Yes they are conditioned by patriarchy but would'nt you think they are the ones who should change first?
Even Indian teleserials are filled with woman against woman tales of plotting and ranting..

Sorry to use this comment space for this but just take a look at thislink.My problems and annoyances suddenly shrink when I look at these images.All you fellow bloggers, in addition to wasting time ranting,raving and arguing on a blog, go do something out there that really matters.Yes And I try to practice what I preach.

In peace..
Go out and do something instead of

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ guptavati: I blog yes. But I also dont sit around complaining.
I cant tell you where exactly I work, but let me tell you that my job involves a lot of counselling...I work as an adolescent counsellor, helping teen girls with their problems(though we have helped twenty-somethings on numerous occasions).
And believe me their 'problems' are so horrific, you can imagine the magnitude..of what Im saying.
They are so shocking that, if we hear about a teenage pregnancy...its just another day for us.
So you get my drift, and the magnitude of the incidents we come across.

Every summer, I also mentor and counsel high school students, who are not-so good in academics to STAY in school, and I tutor them in mathematics, science and economics.

Im not tooting my horn here.
Im just trying to let you know, that I do try and do something...even though its not in India...I live here....so it only makes sense that I do something here.
so as for your statement "go and and do something instead of ranting"

I do.

peace out.
Megha.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ guptavati:
No hard feelings, k?
:D
Megha

Negative Creep said...

@Asha, sigh. i love how people get all self-righteous and then accuse me of being self-righteous.

@Megha, now that i know what your job is, your posts make a lot more sense. If you're confronted with the same hateful incidents day after day, that will naturally be on your mind whenever you blog, or write, or when you're just plain thinking. But maybe, just maybe, your view is slightly warped because you're looking at it from just one aspect..

I like Vasu's post, he makes a lot more sense, without taking sides... He's been a lot more objective than i have..

Nath said...

I may be missing something here, but I don't see why the government is to blame. The hostel incident seems to be the fault of the warden, not official government policy. As for the Bhargava case, the police seem to be taking measures to capture Pahadi. I don't think it's fair to blame the government for all society's problems; it's not easy keeping violent crime rates as low as they are without turning into a police state. (Of course, I'm not denying that the government is far more corrupt than it should be.)

Like several other posters, I think the root cause of the problem is not with the government, but with peoples' attitudes. More specifically, I think society has self-esteem issues. This is why you encounter people on the street acting like schoolyard bullies. This is also why you have people forcing daft, arbitrary rules onto those they have power over (I'm referring to the so-called moral police you mentioned). I think a lack of pride also explains why corruption is as widespread as it is; you wouldn't accept a bribe if you were proud of what you did for a living.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ Asha: damn woman! you need a blog! You comment was so eloqent...I loved it.

@ Vasu: apology accepted!

@ Bhanuj: Oh please. I am not hate filled and deranged Bhanuj. We are professionals, and we DONT get emotionally attached to every woman who walks in. We cannot help people otherwise.

Are all my posts hateful? I have a considerable amount of posts which are about random things..and they are anything but hateful..and they have nothing to do with feminism at all.
And please refrain from making judgements on my character or my sanity.
I think Im as normal as the next 22 year old, juggling classes and work.
I dont make judgements on you. I think it is fair that you REFRAIN from making faulty judgements on my character, and stick to the post.
The last time I remembered, this was MY blog.
Thank you.
@ nath: So the warden is an autonomous entity? With the moral police influencing things like a blanket curfew for clubs in Chennai and other ridiculous things, why cant they make use of their clout in an issue that actually needs intervention?
thats my point, and if you read the article, the author has mentioned that as well.

useless said...

Megha,
Why hard feelings? :)
I am glad you wrote that.The reason I wrote this is to make folks realize the magnitude of these issues and that this is a universal problem and not one a few 'chalu' girls/women like us create...

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ guptavati: thank you Gupta-vati!
//he reason I wrote this is to make folks realize the magnitude of these issues and that this is a universal problem and not one a few 'chalu' girls/women like us create...//
so true.
I couldnt have put it better myself.
Cheers!
Megha

Negative Creep said...

Megha, seriously, i'd like you to point out when i siad you were deranged, or generally hateful, or whatever... just point that out.. I know this is your blog, you don't need to point it out everytime i disagree with something you say... Sheesh, calm down...

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ bhanuj: I point it out everytime you make a personal attack.
Not when you disagree with my posts.

Anonymous said...

Thanks, Megha

NC, where did I call anyone self righteous?

ASHA

Mukund said...

its rather disgusting n distressing to read about the madurai hostel! as for the meher bharghava case, it shows that if one has power, he can get away with anything in India. read this piece which i wrote on a similar issue sometime back

http://vakilsmusings.blogspot.com/2006/02/of-courts-and-justice_27.html

Yogi said...

seriously, your blog is all fine, nothin to do with it, infact i enjoy reading it or i wouldnt be here trust me, but why do you keep avoiding the question of trying to do somethign about it all through the post, everyone has asked you what you could do about it, and you have been avoiding that question conveniently.. but on the whole its your decision to make a post on something as important as this and then saying thats all i can do..i am a feminist and i try to be one, not just talk about it, of course this is not the medium either where i should express what i try to do to set things right..after all i have been in your side of the world long enough to know how easy it is to be there, thats why i came back here.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ mukund: will do rite now.

@ yogi: Please scroll up and look at the comments and see what I do for work. You dont have a clue as to what I see and go through on a daily basis do you?

And as for proposing solutions, the only solution I can think of is a petition to the CM, to replace the ridiculous warden and eslablish better sanitation, which has already been taken up by a bunch of people, and Im not going to mention their names here cos' I dont want their work to be subjected to acidic criticism as well.

And it is very easy to point fingers at 'so called feminists' for talking about issues like this. What would you want us to talk about? Breakfast? My clothes? What I drank yesterday? Is that acceptable?

Atleast I spoke about this issue. What have you done?
Actually dont answer. Im done with you here.

Artful Badger said...

In every society there are all types of people. However, how much of a general phenomenon do you think it is? Whatever you do there will always be some psycho incidents, and though they might be indicative of possible difficulties in the system, genearlizing from that can be a little iffy.
To what extent is such behaviour pervasive?
Why would you think society dislikes women?
Today, quite a lot of Indian women have careers, and where there is money, there is independance. I don't know about lower classes of society, but most don't need to put up with such nonsense. I don't think that men are that bad either. Most people with an education and some sense wouldn't indulge in such things (i think!). :)

4WD said...

Wow. I wish I had these many posts on my blog. Damn, i have to follow NDTV more :) *in our newsroom, no-one really watches ND, cos we all know they follow our stories. We watch Sahara NCR* heh.

I dont have anything constructive to say, except to Negative Creep.
Here's what i'm saying, ``My man, you are 17. You said you plan to `do something about it'. Here's a bit of a head's up for you: In this country, women do have the raw deal. That is the truth. Unless you acknowledge that, you can't do anything about it. Now lets see what you do about it.

Every story about women being opressed/ tortured, is not an attack on your manhood (i dont mean
that manhood, i mean it in the actual dictionary meaning). If you read/saw the story, you'd know that it was done by Sanjay Pinto, ND's very south indian, mustachiod South India Correspondent. What're you going to do? call him and rant? STD from chandigarh? shouldn't cost a lot with OneIndia.

Next, young man, before you make random statements about socio-economic status, you really should check and see where most sex crimes happen.

There are a lot more Meher Bhargavas than Nitish Katara's... hope you know... and killing Katara was also essentially a crime against Bharti Yadav.

Next, young man, learn to type right.


Isn't it cool that a 24 year old can call a 17 year old `young man'? If i were Sanjay Pinto, i'd call him `eng Man'.

I have more bones to pick (with vasu, for that media comment... if it weren't for the frigin media, this post wouldn't exist, and you wouldn't get to make that media comment, or comment about Meher Bhargava. And don't you wish you knew what the media really knows about Pahadi.

And for that megha's comment about democracy. Disagree, but don't care now, cos i'm drunk, and think your pic is cute :)

Now i'm gonna go post on my blog about me driving perfectly tonight.

-4

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ 4wd: hahahahaaahaha..............
LOVED your comment(bout my pic being cute that is:P)
hee.....hee........

And that comment about the farce of a democracy, was written in anger....at the ridiculous comments piling up...:P
I do have faith in Democracy....however miniscule it may be....:)

Artful Badger said...

I read a bunch of blogs and almost every female blog has it's bunch of trolls.
I think all of you should get together and make a rougues gallery kind of thing with some delicious descriptions. A mugshot type thing..
Should be fun..

the wannabe indian punkster said...

seriously ramani!
That is the single most brilliant idea, Ive heard on this post.
Seriously.
Mugshots...*rubs her hands in glee*

Ohhh.....the temptation....
Why do you put such ideas in my head? Now I have to follow up on it!
:D

Sriram said...

I'm trying my best to get the no. of comments to 100 :P.. so, with that said, I'd love to launch into a long meaningless rant (which I'm sure you'd have realised is my specialty).. what's that you say? rogue gallery of sorts? hmm... is Ramani referring to commenters as trolls? I warn you.. I am NOT a troll.. I am a were-wolf..*proudly displays his fangs and claws and starts to scratch on the monitor*

Nath said...

/* So the warden is an autonomous entity? */
Yes, as far as I can tell the warden was granted a fair bit of autonomy here, and seems to have been the one to make the decision.

/* With the moral police influencing things like a blanket curfew for clubs in Chennai and other ridiculous things, why cant they make use of their clout in an issue that actually needs intervention? */
I was not aware of the curfew in Chennai, so I don't know what the logic behind it is. The only reference to it I could find said it was meant to control drunk driving. I admit that it's a pretty daft idea, but I don't see how it connects to the Adi Dravidar incident. Unless, that is, you meant that the resources spent enforcing silly curfews would be better spent keeping a closer eye on government-sponsored hostels. If that's the case, then the government's only crime here would be failing to solve the problem. The root cause of the problem is still not the government, but people's attitudes.

Madame Mahima said...

lol the mugshot idea thing was hilarious!! I can so see it now - The Troll Board hehe

people, people, pleeeease this is a blog dammit! if we bloggers cant use it for ranting/ posting thoughts/ posting ideas etc etc, without getting shot down after every sentence, then what CAN we use it for?
we can argue with one another till kingdom come but SO WHAT?

i mean seriously..its futile to say what one can write and what one cant...its not as if the trolling (woohoo! new word!) will stop us from saying what we want to on our blogs.

in the time spent shooting down a blogger, imagine the gem of a post (or anything else equally constructive) you could have come up with instead!

now. who needs a drink?
=D

the wannabe indian punkster said...

meeeeeee! I do......tis' calls for a shot of tequila...what say?

4WD said...

Shots, not shot ;)

why do commentors keep coming back to a blog where there's a fight on? Like a boxing match, where the fighters keep going to their corners :) Megha, mind your ear, you're the holyfield here ;)

Anna said...

Megha! look at this comment box! More than 102 entries...
And this is supposed to be a rant.. what a readership you have!
But i really think you should put up a new post as soon as the comments reach 90.
Thats the only way you can distract these people... by putting up an even more debatable post!

Anonymous said...

bahh!!!
do u ever having anything nice and sweet to talk about?

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ 4WD: I meant 'a shot' akin 'one shot' but after all this...I think I need a 'few shots'.=D

@ Anna: hahahaha....I guess I should!

@ anon aka syrupy prick: you gotta problem? Take your ass someplace else.
Thanks.

Yogi said...

well, you write well, use it on more established forms of media like an article in a local newspaper here, i know it requires a bit of boldness on your part but still, rather than from there, come see villages here and see how the situation is..thats what we do, come pick up an old disabled/special lady/children from the street and give her a good home(the organisation is called banyan, if you want to contribute to them, know you are a student, but whatever you can, and it is run by two lovely old ladies just incase you are afraid its a political gimmick).. dont write tho cos i have no talent for that..but there are tons you can do, i dont need to elucidate on that, but all i have been tryin to say is that you can do so much more, and youre going on some other tangent which i dont think is really necessary

Dee said...

Megha: 106 comments?! whoa!

It seems as though it's probably more of an effort to keep up with the comments than to write the post in itself =P

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ yogi: you just dont quit offering unsolicited advice do you?
do you know who I am? Do you know my life? do you know what I do? do you have any idea?

I mean....you're unbelieveable!

How can you assume that I just rant, without knowing anything about me?

How can you just pass blanket judgements and offer unsolicited advice to someone you dont know from eve, just because she chose to talk about an issue?

I told you once, we are done here.
Do not answer.

PS: I DO know about Banyan. My family has made several donations to Banyan and they continue to do so.

So this is yet another example at your penchant to offer unwanted advice, WITHOUT knowing anything about the person in question.

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ dee: tell me about it! So tiresome....esp them odious comments....you know what I mean...:D

Yogi said...

good advice never hurts..however you want to take it :)

yuvraj said...

hey...
@anonymous fag: have the balls to reveal ur name? get in to the war as a man..dont spoil the post....

Deepali said...

megha: *rolls eyes at the said comments* I feel for you woman.

You know what I do like though? When women do stick up for other women- it seems to have become so rare that I need to write this in a comment box .

Artful Badger said...

Wow people have so much free time. Considering that I could actually notice that and type out this comment. What does that say about me?

Negative Creep said...

@Megha, i repeat. please point out any personal attacks i've made... I mentioned in my 2nd or 3rd comment that this wasn't referring to this post or even this blog.

@4wd. Bwahahaha. Honestly, i'm wondering whether you even read my posts in full.

1. I've never denied that women get a raw deal, and i've said before and even in an earlier comment on this post that a significant minority of men are total frigging jerks.

2. Puhleez, an attack on my manhood? This makes it even more obvious how you either didn't read my post or didn't understand it. In fact, i'm pretty positive that after reading a few lines, you already pinned me down as a feminist hating, macho jock type. You couldn't be more wrong. You're welcome to come to my blog and read a couple of rants that i've made earlier about this. Just because i'm not politically correct, and dare to question a feminist rant, doesn't mean i'm anti-women, or a chauvinist. The point was not against the story. If for any reason i'd call the "mustachioed" ( the fact that you made it a point to mention this only strengthens my conviction that you've made an erronous assessment of my character ) South Indian reporter would be to congratulate him on bringing this out. You seem to have missed the point entirely.

3. I specifically mentioned that my comments were a rant, and just like Megha's rant only expresses my feelings at that point, and not my entire outlook on such issues.

4. Vasu's comments are absolutely valid and make perfect sense. From what you said, we should be grateful to the media for bringing out this story. To my knowledge, and correct me if i'm wrong, that's their job. Going by your logic, we ought to be grateful to our politicians too, corrupt, cheating, and lying bastards that they are, for ru(i)nning our country. In my opinion however, we should rather ensure tha they give us accurate and unbiased news. If you know anything about journalism, you'd know that very few news articles that are printed are entirely ccurate or unbiased. News is business after all, and to sell, they have to put a spin on things. Don't trust everything you read in the papers my friend. The media is very powerful, and in India pretty unregulated. And they're free to do whatever they want, highlight one aspect of a case to make it seem like the only one. It's a business after all.

And well, yes. i am 17. If you think that being 24 gives you greater insight or intelligence or maturity, well in the words of a very splendid bugger, Mr. Eric Cartman,

" How would you like to SUCK MY BALLS? "

And yes i know that wasn't very mature of me. I'm out of here.

Megha, looking forward to your next post.

Negative Creep said...

And before you make a tell me to learn how to type gain, you might wanna look up typos. typographical errors, that is,..

Deepali said...

I just read the bit about where you work and I'd like to say this because people seem to forget this often:

Megha doesn't need to be in India to help other Indian women. There are plenty of women of South Asian origin in the states and really odds are, she'd encounter one of these women in the work she does [not very fortunate but it's a reality]. Infact, women of South Asian origin, especially those not as fluent in English can really use the help of people like Megha, to be able to communicate with them about their problems and their source(s) of distress. More so, since they've lost their networks as refugees/immigrants in a new country.

It doesn't matter if Megha does or doesn't directly engage in the above but fact is when women like her do, they are helping South Asian women.

So let's not be quick to point fingers.

When you've worked in a similar environment, let's see how you don't feel like ranting about the inequalities you see not only yourself, but others face [who may be a lot badly off than most of us here].

If you don't like what she has written or writes you're more than free to google out blogs that do subscribe to your pov.

[Unless Megha thinks otherwise, in which case, feel free to correct me Megha!]

Really people!

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ dee:
*bows*

I couldnt have put it better myself.

Thankoo!

@ ramani:
ha ha I dunno man......:D

hybridisation said...

couldn't agree more with negative creep.

Venkat Ramanan said...

Hey Megha,
Did you watch the Tamil flick "Kalaaba Kadhala?". I was thinking that you would write about that movie (had you seen it) :)
Another Tamil movie which glorifes virginity. May be you should watch it and write about it!!
PS. It is a ***sick*** movie!!! [:)]

Casablanca said...

Makes me sick reading all those articles. So much for economic progress, and 'India shining', if society continues to remain so degenerate. And the worst feeling is the helplessness that faces us.

4WD said...

ha ha. negative creep. For once you're spot on. I actually don't read your posts fully. Why would I?

Lessons on media ~ sorry bro, all over my head. I don't have any connection with the field. Its too unregulated for me :) I just get paid for writing slop like megha.

shots of raging bull, anyone? I'll bring the tequila.

suryakannan said...

I hail from the outskirts of 'madurai' city.Madurai is still more dangerous than chennai coz women suffer in silence.There is a nasty tradition here that when a husband dies, there is a 'dark event' which is celebrated with more energy by the other women disguised in the form of mourning.Head of a widow is shaved and the bangles are broken and she is considered as an outcast for the rest of her life, even the grocers don't sell rice or vegetables to them fearing that they may also die as her husband did assuming tht she alone was responsible as a bad omen.There are lots and lots of unreported harassments taking place here in ration stores ,schools,settlement of land disputes. For everything women has to suffer in exchange of the commodities.

Anonymous said...

megha what about the horribly filthy comments on women's blogs? I would totally add it to the list.

T

chandni said...

hey megha...

read a lot of what u've written and I am really glad someone is articulating lots of imp issues so well!!

keep writing!!

do check out my space sometime, especially the post on sex harrassment: http://chandni.wordpress.com/2006/03/11/of-streets-and-harassment/

Ragnell said...

Excellent rant, and those are truly horrifying articles. Not nearly as horrifying, though, as the attempts to derail and/or silence your outrage in the comments under the cloak of false diplomacy.

I hope you haven't been trying sunlight, because that doesn't actually turn the trolls to stone. It slows the nocturnal types down, but they come back twice as strong in the cover of darkness.

And when you cut off a limb, or disentegrate any body part, it does grow back unfortunately.

I hear fire works wonders. You have all these lovely strawfeminists lying around on this thread, may I suggest picking them apart and setting them ablaze?

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ ragnell:
Heck yeah! PLEASE....the comments page was one whole conglomeration of STRAWFEMINISTS who subscribe to views like: "oh its the womans fault! Why dosent she stand up for herself" or even worse...tripe like "why blame all men, for a SELECT few's actions".

I mean, come on people, get out of your holes and look at the world.

Ragnell,you have any ideas, horrific enough to set them straight?
I do like the picking them apart option.
Hell yeah, I do.

confused said...

Hey,

Juss wanted to tell ye saw your blog being mentioned in today's edition of the Times of India. You might check it... I think you have to go through the e paper route...

best

Vasu the terrible said...

@megha - I was reading your comments and was astonished to see them.

No body is saying anything wronga about women in general and anyone in particular. As someone said, this is one topic there is a cosnensus.

What I find difficult to understand why you divide the topic by going to the extreme ? Is that the only way to look at the issue.

Here I am telling you that there is a lot more to such acts than pureplay patriarchy and you seem to be not even willing to think or engage in meaningfull debate.

I think you are closing your mind to other people's perspectives.

This is fast degenerating into an ego hassel among unkwon bloggers. Its not my kind of thing, and I was wishfully thinking that people may be a little reasonable about hearing other people's opinions without thrashing them outright.

ofcourse it is your blog. maybe its time to post another one. Mundane and irreverant. This shit is going nowhere. In hindi we call it tu, tu, mein mein.

vasu

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@confused: where at? I searched and searched but I couldnt find it? Could you email it to me?
Thanks:).

confused said...

Sorry, cant email it to you as it is not on the site but on the epaper, which is the exact replica of the print edition. As far as I remember, it does not have the option of emailing.

Here is what you can do..

Go to www.timesofindia.com

on the side bar, you can see e paper...

click on it...(you will need an IndiaTimes id..if you dt have one-create one..takes about 1 minute...)

select the edition-Delhi edition(default edition is Mumbai)

Right on the front page on th2 4th April edition you will see an article titled ''blogs angry about Meher case'' or something like that...

click anywhere on the article, and it will pop up and you can see the mention about your blog along with a direct quote...and one of the comments too..

hope this helps...if it does not drop me a line at confusedgathe@gmail.com...and I will see if there is any other way...

Thanks and congratulations...:)

P.S If due to time difference, a new edition is up by the time you check it... you can check previous 7 days archives of the e papaer..option on the top when you open it...remember..its on thr 4th April edition..

the wannabe indian punkster said...

@ vasu: a new, and a much lighter post is up!
cheers!
Megha

eternal flunky said...

i think there ARE lot of possitive developments that are contributing to the 'emancipation' of women from structures and prejudice, though very/too slowly, with the help of womens' self-help groups, and work of lot of ngos and serios and committed people. and if you think groping , violence, etc... are part of man's instinct, i wish, wish is all i can, to disagree.

Anonymous said...
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Premalatha said...

thanks for adding that info here. I have linked your post.

Rick J said...
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Health Fitness said...
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Womans Health News said...
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